Ep35: Dusting Off The Mics

[00:00:00] [SPEAKER_02] Hello and welcome to The Mediums Voice Podcast. I'm here with my co-host Philip.

[00:00:06] [SPEAKER_00] Hello everyone, good to be back.

[00:00:08] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, we were just having a bit of a laugh then, weren't we? Because Phil just put the headphones on me and I was just like, God, don't I sound loud with the headphones on? And he's like, yeah, that's why I have to keep turning you down.

[00:00:23] [SPEAKER_00] Just halfway through the podcast, just cut a mic.

[00:00:27] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, you've done that before though and used the excuse that it was.

[00:00:31] [SPEAKER_00] Oh, I forgot to plug a mic in.

[00:00:33] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah. That actually has happened, people. Yeah, it has. Yeah, it did, didn't it? Just once. So what have you been up to then? Well, I don't know where you've been. Actually, it sounds so wrong.

[00:00:47] [SPEAKER_00] What do you mean?

[00:00:49] [SPEAKER_02] I'll rephrase that.

[00:00:52] [SPEAKER_00] Oh, God. I know. You've had too much sugar.

[00:00:56] [SPEAKER_02] Oh, yeah. We've just been so... We've just actually scoffed a Mackey. A fat Donalds. I know. I keep saying, do you know what, I'm going on a diet and it never happens.

[00:01:05] [SPEAKER_00] I've got a wedding to go to next year. Have you? Six months time.

[00:01:09] [SPEAKER_02] Look at the state of me. Yeah. You've got six months to lose it. Exactly, yeah.

[00:01:19] [SPEAKER_00] Oh dear. I'll put myself through AI and I'll lose 10 stone and I'll be alright. I know.

[00:01:24] [SPEAKER_02] Actually, we've just been looking on AI, haven't we?

[00:01:27] [SPEAKER_00] We have, yeah. Yeah. Something else.

[00:01:29] [SPEAKER_02] I know. Isn't it... Do you know when you look at some of the AI adverts, some of them are okay, I think, but then there's others where you think... We were just laughing at one from you from a while ago, weren't we? Oh, yeah. A church had used AI as an advert.

[00:01:46] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, for me, doing the demonstration. Yeah. I looked and I was like... I just looked like a fat American.

[00:01:51] [SPEAKER_02] Oh my God, that doesn't even look like you. Can you imagine when you turn up and people look and they go, that's not who I saw on

[00:01:59] [SPEAKER_00] the advert. Why is he 20 stone heavier than in the picture?

[00:02:03] [SPEAKER_02] And your face looks totally different.

[00:02:05] [SPEAKER_00] And he's got brown hair and not pure blonde hair.

[00:02:10] [SPEAKER_02] It was funny, weren't it? Because I remember sending that and going, who is this person? Do we know this person?

[00:02:19] [SPEAKER_00] I certainly don't.

[00:02:20] I know.

[00:02:21] [SPEAKER_02] So yeah, some of the AI, I think... Slop. Yeah. Yeah, I think it has its place for adverts and it can be really helpful. But I think you do have to be careful, don't you? Because some of the faces or bodies as well are not just what you look like. Somebody did one of me actually, not long ago, and I look like a farmer. That looks funny though.

[00:02:52] [SPEAKER_02] I was like, no.

[00:02:55] [SPEAKER_00] Actually, do you know what we should have done that time when you were on about hiring a yacht? Because you thought you were a millionaire or something. We should AI you into a yacht.

[00:03:05] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah. Yeah, you could do that. I'm just like, yeah, I'm off on holiday.

[00:03:09] [SPEAKER_00] You can just pretend that you had someone, what's the word, chartering you around.

[00:03:15] [SPEAKER_02] Chartering me around. Yeah, that was when I was going on holiday, wasn't it? Yeah. I remember that actually.

[00:03:20] [SPEAKER_00] So do I. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:03:22] Yeah.

[00:03:23] [SPEAKER_02] I was trying to find somewhere to go, wasn't I? And then I found this yacht that was like £4,000 a day. I thought it'd be cheap, but yeah, obviously not. That just goes to show how often I hire yachts then, doesn't it? Yeah.

[00:03:39] [SPEAKER_00] To be fair, there was that time we debated hiring a helicopter to take us to an event. I won't say the event, but we were like, oh, if we arrive at... Yeah. We were like, oh, that's so funny. Yeah. It's only £10,000 for an hour.

[00:03:53] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah. Do you think we live in a different world, Phil?

[00:03:56] [SPEAKER_00] Some of us more than others, Michelle, yes.

[00:04:00] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah. Yeah. So, what are we going to talk about today then, Phil? Oh. I feel like it's been...

[00:04:05] [SPEAKER_00] It's been too long, hasn't it? A while, has it? It's been really busy, yeah. Positive news is we've started to upload to YouTube now, so I'm starting to migrate everything across so people will be able to listen on YouTube that previously couldn't. I know that's always been a hurdle we've had. What else have we got going on? You've got some Dems coming up. I've got some development class stuff coming up.

[00:04:35] [SPEAKER_00] It's difficult. I know we've had... Actually, we had some emails in, didn't we? We did, actually.

[00:04:41] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, I went... I did a demonstration and a lovely gentleman came up to me who was blind. Yeah. And he was just saying how much he enjoyed listening to the podcast. It was John, wasn't it? Yeah. John, yeah. Yeah. And he obviously recognised... It's the voice, isn't it?

[00:05:03] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, I was just going to say, go on, don't hold back. Tell people how we recognised you. My voice. Tell people how much from that quiet, quiet voice that Michelle has. I said, did she ask him if he had nightmares over her? But she didn't ask that question for some reason. No, I did not. But yeah, so we've had an email in from John about that, which is a valid point, actually, because I think when you say to people that you see things from the spirit world,

[00:05:31] [SPEAKER_00] people think you're always physically seeing them, don't they? Yeah. If you're talking to Joe Bloggs out in the public who think, oh, you see spirits, they think you see them like you're...

[00:05:41] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, they automatically think, yeah, that... Well, some people do as well. Yeah. But generally speaking, that's not the case. When you have a disability and you are a working medium as well. Yeah.

[00:05:51] [SPEAKER_00] And that just proves, I think...

[00:05:53] [SPEAKER_02] It must heighten your senses as well, though.

[00:05:55] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, I was just going to say, and I also think the spirit world will find a way to get the information to you. Mm-hmm. And not necessarily with talking about disabilities, but when we think about our own mediumship, if we've walked away from certain aspects of it for whatever reason or thought, I'm going to have a break from that, the spirit world find a way to get you back, don't they?

[00:06:18] [SPEAKER_02] They always bring you back in, don't they? Yeah, absolutely. I think there's definitely been times where I've questioned my... I'm not going to say not question my faith, but questioned on the path that I was going on is probably more to the point. Yeah.

[00:06:39] [SPEAKER_00] Whether that was the right one.

[00:06:40] [SPEAKER_02] Whether it was the right one, yeah. There have been times when I've questioned. And it does leave you a bit flat, doesn't it, at times? But I think, as well, though, they're just periods that we go through and...

[00:06:54] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah. I remember having about six months of doing no mediumship whatsoever. Really? Yeah. And one day I was just like, oh, I'm going to pop down to church and just see what it's like again, if you know what I mean. Yeah. And then it was an open circle I'd gone to. And straight away the spiritual world were there, like, it's about blinking time. Yeah. And then I got the bug again, straight away. I don't think...

[00:07:23] [SPEAKER_02] I don't know. I don't think you ever lose the bug. No, I don't think you do. Definitely not. But I just think that sometimes what goes on in our life can sometimes lead us on a different path of learning. That's all. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. I know one time I questioned... We're talking a while back. You know, I questioned my path and I ended up going down a road more about philosophy.

[00:07:49] [SPEAKER_02] And that actually helped with, you know, where I am and what I do today as well. Yeah. I can imagine. Part and parcel of what you do, isn't it?

[00:07:57] [SPEAKER_00] It is, yeah. Yeah.

[00:07:58] [SPEAKER_02] So, yeah, I think even though that we question things and we think that, you know, not that we've lost interest, but you just think that sometimes, you know, I'm like, is this where I am supposed to be going? Is this the path? And I think we're just learning different things, aren't we?

[00:08:16] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, true. Just digressing slightly, but I've often wondered if I'm on the right path when I've nearly drowned once and I've been on fire once and then my car caught fire once. That's really good luck. I'm thinking, am I really on the right path then? Is this really where I'm meant to be going? Yeah.

[00:08:32] [SPEAKER_02] How did you catch on fire?

[00:08:34] [SPEAKER_00] Well, I was camping once and... But I thought I was bad. Oh yeah. Oh, I'm terrible. I mean, I got lost in France the week before I nearly drowned as well, which was just to add to the whole drama. But I was stood by a fire and me being me, never shutting my mouth up and I was talking away to my friend, I thought it was just the heat off the fire. That was warm in my leg. But actually, my clothes were on fire. You were so warm on fire. Oh my God, Phil. Yeah, I know.

[00:09:01] [SPEAKER_00] And it was only when it got very close to a certain area that I won't say on the podcast that I was like, oh...

[00:09:08] [SPEAKER_02] Singe-in.

[00:09:10] [SPEAKER_00] And obviously, what do you do when you're on fire, Michelle? What is it that you're taught from a child all the way until... Smother the flames. Yeah. Stop, drop and roll, they say, don't they? Yes. That's what they say. Wrap yourself up. Wrap yourself up in something. What I did is run straight into a highly flammable tent. What? Yes, because that's what you do when you're on fire. And everyone then obviously start trying to put the fire out on my legs, yeah. So they didn't burn with me.

[00:09:39] [SPEAKER_02] Why did you run into the tent?

[00:09:40] [SPEAKER_00] Well, I don't know.

[00:09:41] [SPEAKER_02] What was in the tent that made you walk up?

[00:09:43] [SPEAKER_00] People, I guess. Maybe I just thought if I'm going down, you're going down with us. Screw the lot of you.

[00:09:49] [SPEAKER_02] I nearly drowned once.

[00:09:51] [SPEAKER_00] Oh, I had laminated leg by the end of that. It was horrendous.

[00:09:54] [SPEAKER_02] Really? Oh, bloody hell.

[00:09:56] Yeah.

[00:09:57] [SPEAKER_00] I know.

[00:09:57] [SPEAKER_02] Oh my God. I nearly drowned once. Funny enough, my husband was lifeguard at the time.

[00:10:03] [SPEAKER_00] Explains a lot, doesn't it, eh? That's a lot, doesn't it? Oh no. Chris, I'm drowning. He never saw me. So he said... Wait, wait. I've got a question. This is crucial, this question. Was this before you'd met Chris and were in a relationship with him?

[00:10:19] [SPEAKER_02] No, it was while we were married.

[00:10:20] [SPEAKER_00] Oh, that explains it all then, doesn't it, eh? Oh, I've not seen anyone drowning down there.

[00:10:25] [SPEAKER_02] Do you know what? Actually, it was his mum that saved me. Honestly, I remember the day, right? Honestly, right, so there was two lifeguards on. He was lifeguard on one end of the pool and there was another lifeguard on the other end. To be fair, where he was, he couldn't see me. So he was on the other side of the pool.

[00:10:46] [SPEAKER_00] You keep telling yourself that, Michelle.

[00:10:47] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, I know. And I'd said to my son, the inflatables were out. And I was like, it's fine, I'll catch you. He couldn't... He was not a very good swimmer. So I never even thought it's at the deep end. And I was like, I thought I'd be all right. And I was like, it's okay, I'll catch you. Don't worry. Anyway, he jumped. He jumped and I went to catch him and I couldn't hold him up. And I was just doggy paddling under the water holding him up above my head.

[00:11:14] [SPEAKER_02] And I actually remember thinking, my God, I can't do this. I'm going to go in a minute. And then all of a sudden his mum drags him off me. But the worst thing was though, Phil, right? I swam to the edge of the pool and the lifeguard came over to me and he went, I saw you struggling. Are you okay? And I looked at him and I was like, do I look okay? Do I really look okay?

[00:11:39] [SPEAKER_02] As I'm spitting out water and struggling to breathe. Do you know, I've never forgotten that to this day. I still bring that up.

[00:11:51] [SPEAKER_00] I'm struggling to breathe now laughing at that. Do I look okay?

[00:11:57] [SPEAKER_02] I've nearly drowned.

[00:11:58] [SPEAKER_00] Well, honestly, I know your feeling because obviously when it happened to me, I was quite young as well. And I was with me nana, bless her. Me nana can't swim, right?

[00:12:10] [SPEAKER_02] These are near-death experiences.

[00:12:12] [SPEAKER_00] These are near-death experiences, I tell you. And I, in my infinite wisdom, thought it'd be brilliant to jump into the deep end. Or I thought I was jumping into the middle part of the pool. Anyway, it was the deep end. Me nana's trying to get to us. She can't get to us in time. I'm drowning under this water and coughing up and choking. Luckily, there was somebody there who jumped in and saved me. Yeah, it had a big game over. So you were lucky? Yeah.

[00:12:40] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, but a week prior to that, I got lost in France. Didn't dare speak to the police because I thought they'd only speak French. So I was just wandering around completely lost.

[00:12:49] [SPEAKER_01] You're wandering around? Not speaking to anyone.

[00:12:51] [SPEAKER_00] Little did I know they were looking for me, but... That's funny. Yeah. And then obviously my car caught fire. So yeah, I do wonder if I'm on the right path. Maybe I'm not.

[00:13:02] [SPEAKER_02] Maybe they're trying to send you all these warning signs here.

[00:13:07] [SPEAKER_00] Don't go near fire and don't go near water.

[00:13:09] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, stay away from it all.

[00:13:10] [SPEAKER_00] I mean, the day my car... I know we've dry-gressed massively here, but the day my car caught fire, I was actually travelling here to this church. And obviously when your car catches fire, what you do is just pull over and you call the fire brigade, don't you? Yeah.

[00:13:28] [SPEAKER_02] You don't carry in driving, surely.

[00:13:30] [SPEAKER_00] Exactly, yeah. And you would call the fire brigade. Yeah. Any normal person would call the fire brigade, unless you're Philip. Because what you do is you stop the car and then you phone your mother to tell her that your car's on fire. And my mum was like, why on earth are you ringing me? Are you ringing me? And I was like, I don't know, to be honest. I really don't know.

[00:13:50] [SPEAKER_01] But my car's on fire.

[00:13:51] [SPEAKER_00] But my car's on fire. Shooter, you can fix that, mammy. Fix everything else. I don't know. But I came here and I got picked up on that. I came here and I got a message off the medium about my car. Right. And something going really, really badly wrong with it. And I thought, oh, I couldn't get any wrong than it's got today. I said to him, I said, he's in spirit now, bless him. But I said, oh yeah, call fire whilst I was driving here. Yeah. So that was good evidence.

[00:14:20] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah. Do you think you were actually meant to attend this service? Maybe I'm not meant to be a spiritualist. I'm just like...

[00:14:29] [SPEAKER_00] But yeah, so we get curveballs in life, don't we? We do, yeah. Yeah.

[00:14:34] [SPEAKER_02] You've got to have a good curveball, haven't you?

[00:14:36] [SPEAKER_00] Every now and again, just to keep you on your toes. Yeah.

[00:14:39] [SPEAKER_02] Otherwise it gets a bit boring, doesn't it?

[00:14:42] Yeah.

[00:14:43] [SPEAKER_02] So what do you think then, obviously, when you came to church then and you had that message off that medium, what is your... Obviously we're not talking about that message, but because we digress. What would you consider your proof then as evidential? What do you feel like is your proof? If you were getting a message, because everybody's proof's different, isn't it?

[00:15:05] [SPEAKER_00] See for me...

[00:15:06] [SPEAKER_02] What's yours?

[00:15:06] [SPEAKER_00] I don't need evidence of life after death.

[00:15:09] [SPEAKER_02] Right.

[00:15:10] [SPEAKER_00] So, to me, it's nice every now and again, but that's not proof to me. I don't need that. I think for me, the proof would be through science. I think if I could see something objectively...

[00:15:27] [SPEAKER_02] That's good. That's interesting.

[00:15:29] [SPEAKER_00] ...or with science, then that would be my proof, which I'm still looking for. So we just sat recently...

[00:15:35] [SPEAKER_02] We just... Yeah, with Agnese from London Greenwich University.

[00:15:40] [SPEAKER_00] University, yeah.

[00:15:41] [SPEAKER_02] So she came up, you probably saw a photograph on our Facebook page of me looking absolutely... A photo of you. Yeah, absolutely ridiculous. I made sure you didn't get me. It was ridiculous, yes, I know. And I will just put it out there that Phil did not want his photograph taken, but thought it really hilarious to take a photograph of me while I was sat there so I couldn't do anything. At least you're smiling. I looked like I was having my hair highlighted.

[00:16:08] [SPEAKER_00] You did actually, yeah. They do look a bit like that, don't they? But that was really interesting.

[00:16:12] [SPEAKER_02] But yes, so we came along to church, didn't we? And we took part in that experiment. I find that a bit nerve-wracking though.

[00:16:23] [SPEAKER_00] See, I love it. I kind of see it like a challenge for the spirit world where they can provide even more evidence. Hmm. And I think that's what excites me about it, because I'm kind of like... I know this sounds bad, but you could go to a mediumship demonstration week in, week out, and see that evidence. And really, you might see the mediums where they give information that's really specific or unique, which is amazing. Yeah.

[00:16:51] [SPEAKER_00] But then when you see something greater than that, and you can physically see that on a screen that's being presented by scientists who are professionals in their field, it just adds a bit extra.

[00:17:02] [SPEAKER_02] It's a bit different, isn't it? Yeah. It's just on another scale really, isn't it?

[00:17:06] [SPEAKER_00] And I kind of feel like, if we're talking about the future of spiritualism, mediumship, the existence of life after death, and the perception of that, I think for younger people, if they can see something physically on a screen that proves that there's something happening when you're doing mediumship, that is very evidential for younger people, I think.

[00:17:30] [SPEAKER_02] Do you know what, as well though, Phil, I think it both goes hand in hand really as well, because I think it's all about the experience as well. Yeah. So for me, it wouldn't just necessarily be about the science part, it's about experience it as well from the spirit world.

[00:17:50] [SPEAKER_02] Because I know there's been times when I've seen and felt the spirit world, or I've done a demonstration where I've had no question whatsoever, because I've been in the moment and I've experienced it.

[00:18:04] [SPEAKER_00] Which is true, yeah. But if you're not working mediumistically, you can't experience it.

[00:18:09] [SPEAKER_02] No, you can't, but that's what I was saying. So for me, it both goes hand in hand, I think.

[00:18:15] [SPEAKER_00] Oh, for your proof. Yeah, for my proof.

[00:18:17] [SPEAKER_02] It's about the experience as well. Because I think you can't tell somebody to believe in the spirit world, they have to experience it for themselves to know that. So for me, it's about both. It's not only the science part, it's about the experience as well.

[00:18:34] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, and I think something that I guess we, maybe we do, maybe we don't, maybe some people do forget about is that communion, isn't it? It's the communion of the two worlds, the spirit world and this world, and those two people come together for that short space of time. Which, as you know, and you just spoke about there, that feeling that you get when that happens and it's right, you can't get that from anything else.

[00:19:00] [SPEAKER_02] You can't question it, yeah. Absolutely, yeah. Yeah. Because you come away and you're like, there's no way I can possibly question what I've just given or what I've just felt.

[00:19:11] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah. So we need a way to bottle that up and study that. What is that feeling? Because I don't know about you, but you know when it's right and you've really kind of got it, shall we say. Which doesn't happen at every demonstration. No, it doesn't. But when it does, you're kind of like, it's different, isn't it? It's a different feeling.

[00:19:34] [SPEAKER_02] Because if you think there's lots of factors going on, isn't there, within when you demonstrate, there's lots of different factors, you know, that could influence the communication.

[00:19:47] [SPEAKER_00] She's just putting a cool time here.

[00:19:49] [SPEAKER_02] I've just gone a bit chilly. Yeah, it has gone chilly, hasn't it? So I'm just putting my...

[00:19:53] [SPEAKER_00] Maybe it's a spirit world.

[00:19:55] [SPEAKER_02] My woolly jumper on because it's gone cold. So yeah, so when we talk about the evidence, for me, it is a bit of both. Yeah. Definitely a bit of both. But, you know, going back to evidence, you know, I've had... Do you know what? I find as well, though, that I don't get many messages now anymore. I wonder why that is. Yeah, I don't either. Yeah.

[00:20:21] [SPEAKER_00] But I think it's because, well, definitely for me, I don't need it anymore.

[00:20:28] [SPEAKER_02] Well, I would like them. I would like them. I would like some. Every week, please. Yeah. I think it's nice every now and again. Just because I'm a medium, it doesn't mean to say that I don't want any. No, I know. I would still like to hear messages. And we've discussed this before, haven't we? Yeah, we have, yeah.

[00:20:44] [SPEAKER_00] But I don't need a message. I really don't. I know the people in the spirit world are there around me.

[00:20:52] [SPEAKER_02] But you like psychic messages, though, as well, don't you? Yeah.

[00:20:57] [SPEAKER_00] Needing guidance. Yeah.

[00:20:59] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah.

[00:21:00] [SPEAKER_01] Yeah.

[00:21:00] [SPEAKER_00] And that could be influenced by the spirit world as well. Yeah. But yeah, I don't need evidence of life after death anymore.

[00:21:09] [SPEAKER_02] No, I don't. But I do like to have a message. Even though I'm still searching for proof.

[00:21:13] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah. But I don't need that from communion with my loved ones. I want proof from something else.

[00:21:19] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah. Because though, even when you do get a message, Phil, though, because I've been with you and you've had a message from a loved one in the spirit world. I'm not going to say who, because obviously I think it could influence somebody. Yeah. You just don't know, do you? Yeah, exactly. So when you do get a message, you know, you're quite, it lifts you, doesn't it? It makes you happy. Yeah, I would say so, yeah. Yeah. And it doesn't have to bring proof, does it? No. It's not all about evidence. Yeah.

[00:21:48] [SPEAKER_02] No, but what I'm saying is like some message, some people do need the proof. Some people are still searching for that proof and some people don't need the proof.

[00:21:57] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah. And some people just need that communication. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:22:01] [SPEAKER_02] And either way, it's nice to get a message and it's, it does uplift you, doesn't it?

[00:22:10] [SPEAKER_00] I mean, I've had times where I'm doing a demonstration and then all of a sudden I'm aware of somebody in the spirit world and I'm like, okay.

[00:22:18] [SPEAKER_02] Well, I should hope so if you're doing demonstrations. Well, someone that I know, should I say. Yeah. I'd be really.

[00:22:23] [SPEAKER_00] Good point, actually, yeah. Phil's doing a demonstration.

[00:22:26] [SPEAKER_02] A demonstration and he's a winner.

[00:22:29] [SPEAKER_00] No one. No one's there.

[00:22:31] [SPEAKER_02] Have you ever had that? I've heard some people say that they've got up and they've not had anything.

[00:22:36] [SPEAKER_00] I've had one experience where I got up and there was nothing for like a couple of minutes. Right. That was really horrible to experience. Yeah. Because I was just like.

[00:22:52] [SPEAKER_02] But that surely made it worse if you panic though. Yeah. It does, yeah. I've not experienced that. I don't want to touch wood, touch that table.

[00:23:01] [SPEAKER_00] But then I just, then I became aware then of the spirit world.

[00:23:05] [SPEAKER_02] So do you think that's.

[00:23:06] [SPEAKER_00] But there was usually, there's, when in that instance anyway, there was a piece of evidence that I was missing. Yeah. And that's why it came forward like that. Yeah. When I look back now.

[00:23:16] [SPEAKER_02] I was going to say, do you think that you've just slightly missed the communication? Yeah. Yeah.

[00:23:20] [SPEAKER_00] There was something there already that I'd missed. Yeah. And that feeling of nothingness was actually part of the, the evidence.

[00:23:29] [SPEAKER_02] Because I, I don't think for one minute that when you stand up there, there's nobody there. I don't believe that whatsoever. Of course not. Why, why on earth?

[00:23:40] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah. The spirit world know you're going there.

[00:23:42] [SPEAKER_02] Of course they do. They're intelligent. They would never.

[00:23:44] [SPEAKER_00] Even when your car catches fire on the way. They know.

[00:23:47] [SPEAKER_02] They know. Yes. Of course they do. Yeah. So, and I just think if, if you're not picking anything up, then there's a communication problem here.

[00:23:55] [SPEAKER_00] With yourself. Yes. You moving yourself into that right place. Yeah.

[00:23:58] [SPEAKER_02] Exactly. Yeah. It's definitely, I don't believe for one minute that there isn't an instance where the spirit world would not come. Because what would be the point? It's about trust, isn't it? Yeah. And what would be the point of everybody attending? What would be the point of you standing up there? It just wouldn't make any sense whatsoever. Yeah. No, so I don't, I don't get that. But going back to, I have had some really good messages.

[00:24:27] [SPEAKER_02] And I'd probably say, I don't really want to name names, but I'll name a name. The best message I ever had of communication was from Andy Bing.

[00:24:41] [SPEAKER_00] Oh, right. Yes. Yeah. He's really good.

[00:24:44] [SPEAKER_02] I went to watch him and he gave me a message. And amazing. Yeah. Really, really good. Yeah.

[00:24:52] [SPEAKER_00] I saw him demonstrate in Birmingham, I think it was. And also do some lectures and yeah. Yeah. I've listened to his lectures.

[00:25:02] [SPEAKER_02] His philosophy is second to none, isn't it? It's brilliant. Really good. Yeah. So I do admire him.

[00:25:09] [SPEAKER_00] But on about getting up at demonstrations and having nothing. Now you've said that's never happened to you. You've got a demonstration on Saturday, haven't you? Yeah. Yeah. See what the spirit will do. Then they might just go, all right, shut up. No, I'm joking. No, I don't believe that for one minute.

[00:25:25] [SPEAKER_02] Shut up.

[00:25:27] [SPEAKER_00] I'll just plant that seed there now. No, you won't. That is not happening. Definitely not. I don't believe that for one minute. Yeah. Is it a spirit art dem you've got? It is. Oh, I'm joking.

[00:25:38] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, it is. It's a spirit art dem. Oh, that would be good.

[00:25:41] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah. But at least you'll know if you've got nothing because your paper will be blank.

[00:25:46] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah. Just be doodles. Stick them. Over the rainbow.

[00:25:56] [SPEAKER_00] I don't know if you were in here at the time that I tried to draw a face, but it was dire. Yeah. It was so great. Yeah. I was just like, right, I've tried that now once. I'll never try that again.

[00:26:08] [SPEAKER_02] That is so funny. Do you know what? Weirdly enough, though, before I started out doing the spirit portraits, I've always been animal-based. Oh, yeah. I still love animals, doing drawing animals. It's my thing. But from drawing animals to drawing faces is totally different. Oh, I can imagine, yeah. Catfish. I really had to start from scratch.

[00:26:29] [SPEAKER_00] Although some people do look a bit like a Jack Russell, to be fair.

[00:26:37] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah. And behave like one. But yeah.

[00:26:43] [SPEAKER_00] I quite like drawing plants. So. Why? I don't know. I just find it therapeutic. But I used to draw a lot of plants when I was younger. Because I did art. I did art at school. Did you? Yeah, I did art. But yeah.

[00:26:59] [SPEAKER_02] I love it. I find it so therapeutic. Yeah. I've just been playing around with inks lately.

[00:27:04] [SPEAKER_00] I couldn't do what you do, though. I don't have the patience.

[00:27:06] [SPEAKER_02] I get lost. I honestly. You spend hours on them. I do. And the day's gone. I couldn't be bothered. The day has gone, honestly. But do you know what it is, though? It's the end, final piece. And when you put it in a frame. And you're just like, love it. Absolutely love it. And you've created that. Yeah. Yeah. I've got some commissions I've got to do for Christmas. So I've got all them coming up.

[00:27:29] [SPEAKER_00] You said the C word. I know.

[00:27:30] [SPEAKER_02] Christmas is coming, isn't it? Yeah.

[00:27:32] [SPEAKER_00] It's not far away, to be fair. I know.

[00:27:33] [SPEAKER_02] I've got that coming up. And I'm actually, I'm doing a course with a Portuguese artist at the moment. Oh, yeah. On realism, yeah. So along with other courses to do the SNU as well. So I'm a bit, yeah.

[00:27:52] [SPEAKER_00] 84 days till Christmas.

[00:27:54] [SPEAKER_02] Oh, my God.

[00:27:55] [SPEAKER_00] It's terrifying, isn't it?

[00:27:56] [SPEAKER_02] It is, because I haven't even started Christmas shopping yet.

[00:27:58] [SPEAKER_00] Oh, I don't start Christmas shopping till the week before. Oh, my gosh. Typical man.

[00:28:04] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah. Yeah, my husband just turns up at Christmas Day and then goes. Oh, everything's started. Santa is real. Yeah, Santa has been. He's just turned up on the day.

[00:28:16] [SPEAKER_00] We don't even have a chimney. How did he get down here?

[00:28:20] [SPEAKER_02] Do you know what? Actually, it's probably, this isn't about spiritualism, but I'll tell the story anyway. So every year I do something different at Christmas, at the Christmas table. And every now and again, I do like a big theme. Hangs.

[00:28:36] [SPEAKER_00] Oh, you had that thing last year.

[00:28:39] [SPEAKER_02] Hangs from the ceiling. And so last year I did like pine leaves all coming out of like, it was wrapped in chicken wire and hung from the ceiling. And then I threaded like holly and pine leaves and all that through it.

[00:28:51] [SPEAKER_00] You're such an artist. Do you know that?

[00:28:52] [SPEAKER_02] And then I put lights on it. But then I had this really good idea and thinking, oh, do you know what? I'll put some snow spray on it.

[00:28:59] [SPEAKER_01] Oh, God.

[00:29:01] [SPEAKER_02] And it looked really good. And it did look really pretty. But then after a couple of weeks and we're sat eating Christmas dinner, the snow spray starts dropping on the table. So every year I get, please don't put the snow spray on because it was in our dinner.

[00:29:17] [SPEAKER_00] It's just salt, guys. It's just salt.

[00:29:19] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, it's fine.

[00:29:19] [SPEAKER_00] It's biodegradable.

[00:29:20] [SPEAKER_02] Bits of holly dropping in their turkey.

[00:29:24] [SPEAKER_00] Why don't you do, have you seen them artists that make it on the glass? They spray the glass and then they make like really detailed pictures. Yeah. Why don't you do that?

[00:29:33] [SPEAKER_02] Because I wouldn't be able to do that. I'm just getting stuff like that. Give me a pencil and I'm fine. I couldn't do anything like that. I'd probably just buy the stickers.

[00:29:44] [SPEAKER_00] Oh, yeah.

[00:29:45] [SPEAKER_02] You can get them off TikTok.

[00:29:47] [SPEAKER_00] My patio of dollars, you could make an amazing picture on them. Oh, yeah, because those are really good, aren't they? Yeah, they're massive. Yeah. I can't be bothered. I don't decorate for Christmas. No. I used to, but...

[00:29:59] [SPEAKER_02] Oh, no, I absolutely love it.

[00:30:00] [SPEAKER_00] Oh, I love Christmas, yeah. I love the run-off to Christmas.

[00:30:03] [SPEAKER_02] And I love Christmas in the church as well.

[00:30:04] [SPEAKER_00] Oh, yeah, yeah.

[00:30:05] [SPEAKER_02] It's lovely, isn't it? It's dead Christmassy. And do you know what I think as well? Everybody comes together, don't they? Yeah. Yeah. It's so nice. Yeah, it's just a lovely feel, Christmas time in the church. I do like that. Well, I think it's been...

[00:30:21] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, we need to wrap it up, yeah. Yeah. We have talked a lot. We have talked... Rubbish.

[00:30:25] [SPEAKER_02] Probably not bad anything, but do you know what? I know we've had a little bit of a break, haven't we? Yeah. Yeah. But we... It's been nice to get back together and chat. We've had a lot going on, haven't we? You know, we do this voluntary, don't we? So...

[00:30:40] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah. And, oh, I've just thought... I've got an idea about some merch, some new merch. But we'll have to discuss that before we announce it.

[00:30:50] [SPEAKER_01] Okay.

[00:30:51] [SPEAKER_00] I forgot about that. I was meant to talk to you before we start recording, so... It's too late for that. Anyway.

[00:31:00] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, anyway...

[00:31:02] [SPEAKER_00] Hopefully you've enjoyed this episode. Even though we've just really had a catch-up more than anything else. Yeah, but it's nice to have a catch-up, though. It is, yeah. I think sometimes when we try and... Because we try and structure a lot of episodes, don't we? And sort of pick a subject. But sometimes it's nice just to let it go with the flow and just have a bit of chit-chat and see where we end up, isn't it?

[00:31:25] [SPEAKER_02] Yeah, absolutely. I enjoy it.

[00:31:28] [SPEAKER_00] Thank you very much for tuning in. And we'll have some more episodes out soon. Please do give us a review, if you don't mind. If you haven't already on our website, themediumsoice.co.uk And if you haven't followed us on social media, please do. And give us a subscribe on YouTube because we're now starting to publish everything on YouTube. So, yeah. Keep an eye out. And we'll catch up with you all soon.

[00:31:52] [SPEAKER_01] Bye.

[00:31:53] [SPEAKER_00] Bye.

[00:31:54] Bye. Thank you.